scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 Started with these seeds: 30 Ace Malawi 20 Robogro WOS Wild ThaiX (RoboThai) (Landrace) 30 Roboskunk (various skunky type strains from Robogro) 18 Neville Haze 20 Highland Lao X Thai82 (my own line) (Landraces) Planted in three plantations Plantation 1 Test of RoboThai and Lao/Thai sinsimella unseeded Thai plants to see how the buds look and personal Medical marijuana stash Plantation 2 Most of the skunks (all ex Robogro) personal Medical Marijuana stash Plantation 3 Seed Crop. Objective produce my own Haze line. Grow a bunch of sativas and pick best male and seed the lot just to get plenty of seed to play with. All were planted in the ground outdoors in September. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 Germination: After germination I don't track numbers of plants. I tend to lose them all the time to environment, mould, pests, weather, animals, thieves and bad luck.... so I count the germination and sometimes I remember to count what I harvest but I don't count anything inbetween. Anyway germination on everything was almost 100% except several lines of RoboSkunk seeds that had zero germination. Unfortunately this included a line of HUGE fat seeds that Robogro sent me. I don't know what they were but they were some of the biggest seeds I've ever seen and easily double the size of any other seeds I had. Unfortunately none of them germinated. Everything was planted deep in a rainforest at 52 degrees South. I have never tried to grow cannabis this far South before so the whole thing was a big experiment. I also had to sit on Robogro's seeds for two years before I could use them so they may have been getting stale even though I kept them refrigerated. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 Disclaimer: RoboGro wasn't sure of some of the genetics of the seeds he sent me and the labels were unreadable after two years in a fridge. The ink had run and the pencil faded. There was some Blue Mystic crosses and Black Domino and lots just called Kush. I just call the lot RoboSkunk (more on that later). The RoboThai comes from a twenty foot pure landrace Wild Thai from WOS that Robogro grew and posted pix of at the time. It was seeded by an unknown but Robogro thought it must be a Kush. All I know is that it grows like a pure landrace Thai and it matures even later than some other pure landrace Thais I grow. So I guess it either had some nanas and seeded itself or maybe the landrace Mexican Robogro grew next to the Thai... had some nanas. All I know is that it walks and quacks like a pure sativa all the way and there is no sign of Kush in the plant. Also all the RoboThai plants were huge, vigorous and very similar to each other which was pretty impressive for a random seeding. I use absolutely no sprays at all... so any disease (especially mould) kills my plants. I tend to lose a lot to nature. Previously in other locations I have lost 100% of plants to mould.... or storm damage. It's all part of the adventure. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 The first two months In the first two months I lost 24 of 30 Ace malawi to stem rot In the first two months I lost 18 out of 18 Neville Haze to stem rot In the first two months I lost about 50% of all plants to stem rot. In November I planted 10 landrace Red hair Thai from RealSeed Company. Germination was 100%. There is a lot to tell and I have a lot of photos to upload. I will update this thread as time permits but here is a quick summary. Plantation 1 was wiped out by mould completely when plants were in full bud and most of them over ten feet high. I never harvested a single bud from this crop but I did photograph the damage and will be uploading pix. I know it sounds hard to believe that I had plants that big completely destroyed but I have the photos to prove it. Two nights of high humidity and no wind was all it took. Plantation 2 was 80% wiped out by mould two days before I was going to harvest. I harvested what I could but it was a disaster. All RoboSkunk was completely matured by mid April and finished. Some plants were so done they were dying... yet most of my sativas hadn't even started pre-flowering yet!!! Plantation 3 My seed crop. All sativas. Lost about 10% to mould. Red hair Thai .... latest flowering plant I've ever grown. Have females only just starting to flower now with winter only 3 weeks away. Using a giant Red Hair Thai male to pollinate everything. Not that there is much left LOL. It's been a real trip. I'd also like to take this opportunity to publicly thank RoboGro for keeping me in the game for several years now. He's helped me out before and I'll be talking about his strains in this thread. I will be backing up everything with photos. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 In December I planted four more Neville Haze. I can't speak highly enough of Shantibaba and Mr Nice seeds. Shanti replaced the whole 18 seeds that I lost to stem rot. At the time I blamed stale seed for weak and spindly plants that the mould totally bowled. Like the Neville haze was hit harder than anything by mould. All 18 plants were smaller, slower, spindlier and weaker than any other strain which really suprised me because I expected the opposite from a tropical sativa. I was expecting Neville Haze to be some wild out of control stretchy sativa like all my landraces. All the RoboSkunk plants grew faster and taller when young than the NH. In fact NH was the smallest and slowest of all strains. There's another side to this though. Now I understand why Nevilles Haze is often described as a highly technical plant to grow. In retrospect.... with a bit more experience with this strain under my belt.... I think that this is a technical plant to grow and I will be mentioning what i've learnt about this interesting strain so far. It's turning out to be a very interesting strain indeed once you dial it in... which isn't easy if you're not in the tropics. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 Some pix to get you interested: Seed Crop Roboskunk Giant purple RoboSkunk bud. Heavy and solid with a very strong lavendar/old leather smell Plantation One at dawn (RIP) These are RoboThai plants. Huge Thai bushes (they've been topped about four times) that are very vigorous and branch all over the place. All the RoboThai plants would have been in the fifteen foot plus size if I hadn't kept topping them. This is just one corner of the plantation but the whole crop was destroyed by mould in just two days. same plants two weeks later.... ...... and that is just a sample of the grow.... scrubdog 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
robogro 2,460 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 Dang it,Scrubdog, those turned out great, lots better than I would have expected but seeing how everything you grow is upside down (southern hemisphere), it seems to be working well for you. Sorry to here about the mold, my last try suffered frost about 4 weeks to harvest. cheers and be safe Welcome to OpenGrow 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doush 1 Report post Posted May 9, 2013 What region in NZ are you? Im in Tauranga I just finished the NZ 2012 2013 outdoor season also, it was a tough season with drought followed by high humidity in the flowering stage. I was happy with less than 5% mould in the finish but i had to harvest a couple of weeks premature to avoid what happened to you. Why do you think you got so much stemrot that just seems weird? Was your spot all day sun? Why you growing Sativas with long flowering cycles instead of faster finishers or mainly indicas considering your climate? Are you going to change anything next season? What strains would you recommend for our NZ climate? edit - my best performers were Holy Grail Kush and Cotton Candy this year, next season im thinking of running HGK, Early Girl and not sure maybe WW or NL but im looking to trial a sativa for some personal smoke. Neville is a legend but his Neville Haze does not sound good for our conditions so ill continue the seach... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 Dang it,Scrubdog, those turned out great, lots better than I would have expected but seeing how everything you grow is upside down (southern hemisphere), it seems to be working well for you. Sorry to here about the mold, my last try suffered frost about 4 weeks to harvest. cheers and be safe Welcome to OpenGrow Cheers Robo That purple stuff caught me by suprise. I pulled all the males long before anything changed colur or any females showed any potential. To be honest the whole crop looked very mediocre and it was plagued with mold. Then suddenly some of the plants turned purple... and I mean really purple as you can see from the photos. One plant was nearly black. Then the buds just piled on weight in a few weeks. I don't know what you bred them from but to me I would call it a nearly pure looking purple Afghani. Very heavy and dense purple buds. Every seed you've ever gifted me has had outstanding genetics. I actually planted about 300 of your seeds but as I mentioned there was very poor germination if at all on some of those lines. From memory some of the dates I was able to read were pretty old. Other lines I got 100% germination. You gave me quite a bit to play with. Your Thai was 100% germination. I just wish I'd seeded that purple strain. It's got an amazing smell. I've grown a very similar strain before years ago. Here is another RoboSkunk plant. Very strong lemon smell, very sticky and big open buds that are still quite weighty. Strong lemon taste and makes you cough something wicked. Probably the most potent RoboSkunk. Bud closeup.... really nice plant. Some sort of sativa/indica hybrid by the looks of it. Please note these are Robogro genetics. He produced these crosses himself and all credit to the man. He produces some amazing plants and he has a wealth of knowledge regarding both indoor and outdoor. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 What region in NZ are you? Im in Tauranga I just finished the NZ 2012 outdoor season also, it was a tough season with drought followed by high humidity in the flowering stage. I was happy with less than 5% mould in the finish but i had to harvest a couple of weeks premature to avoid what happened to you. Why do you think you got so much stemrot that just seems weird? ??? Why is that weird??? I wouldn't call it excessive given the situation and circumstances. It was an experimental grow in a new location and things like that are to be expected really. Was your spot all day sun? I have no idea. I've never sat there all day to find out but I doubt it very much. Why you growing Sativas with long flowering cycles instead of faster finishers or mainly indicas considering your climate? I find indicas incredibly boring to both grow and smoke though some of them look gorgeous. i'm old school sativa all the way. If you'd ever smoked real killer sativa then you wouldn't be asking that question. I grow Medical marijuana exclusively and am only interested in the effect and potency.... not yield or commercial value. The long flowering time is an issue but I'll deal with that eventually in my breeding program. Are you going to change anything next season? always.... I've been growing outdoors for thirty years plus and I'm still learning.... What strains would you recommend for our NZ climate? I can't think of a single strain that won't mature in your area. When I lived in the BOP I matured landrace sativas no problems at all. edit - my best performers were Holy Grail Kush and Cotton Candy this year, next season im thinking of running HGK, Early Girl and not sure maybe WW or NL but im looking to trial a sativa for some personal smoke. Neville is a legend but his Neville Haze does not sound good for our conditions so ill continue the seach... There is nothing wrong with Neville Haze at all. As I said it was a learning experience for me with this strain and I wouldn't recommend it to an inexperienced grower because it is a very technical grow. I will explain what I mean by this later in this thread but I will definitely be growing Neville Haze next year. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 Mr Nice Neville Haze.... taken two days ago... scrubdog 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 I might as well explain right now where I went wrong with Nevilles Haze outdoors and why it is such a "technical" plant to grow. Okay years ago I used to grow a landrace African Swazi Red pure sativa and it was the weirdest plant. I'd plant all my seeds at the same time in the Spring every year and the Swazi would always be the spindliest, tiniest crappy little plants you ever did see. The first few times I grew them I actually pulled them all out because they were so weedy looking. Anyway come midsummer when temps got really, really hot outdoors all the plants would sort of slow down and start entering a less vigorous growth stage.... except the Swazi. It would go nuts and grow a foot a day and within a couple of weeks it would shoot up taller than anything else. To this day Swazi Red is the tallest cannabis strain I've ever grown. Swazi was the first 20 foot plant I ever grew. Most of my pure sativa landraces are not like that. Even the ones from the equator. They're the opposite because they're used to weather extremes associated with high rainfall monsoon climates. They're tough as old boots and the best of them grow big and strong at the same temps as high plateau indicas which can tolerate freezing. Nevilles Haze is VERY temperature sensitive outdoors. Looking back I don't think I had old seed. I think the problem was that I simply planted the Nev haze too soon even though it was okay for all the other strains I planted at the same time. Please note.... I'm talking about GROUND TEMPERATURE not air temps the weatherman gives each day. In retrospect I think the fault was all mine and it shows the character of Shantibaba at Mr Nice seeds.... that he replaced all my seed without hesistation even though the fault was probably mine. By the time I got the replacement seeds the ground temps had increased dramatically and I had absolutely no problems of any description with the Neville Haze seeds or plants. They grew fast and strong from day one and eventually they sucked me into their little world. I've never been a fan of Nev Haze because of the Northern Lights content but then again I've never grown it before. The plant has a definite attraction as a compromise sativa. It stretches a lot compared to modern hybrids but still only half the stretch of my most extreme Thais. It flowers very, very late in the season but still before most of my Thais. I like the structure of the plant and I believe I can work with it and use it to bring forward the flowering time of some of my more extreme sativas. It will all depend on what the smoke is like. scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 This is my own line I've been working on for a couple of years to try and build a genetic base for a new Haze. It is Realseed Highland Lao pure landrace sativa x Green Hornet Thai82 pure landrace 1982 Thai Stick. This stuff is old school Thai. It flowers randomly on the same plant and never really goes into full flowering. These old Thai strains (like Thai82 not Highland Lao) tend to skip in and out of vegetative growth, sort of flower a little bit on some branches but not others... then go back into vegetative growth... then flower a bit on some other branches. You need a lot of patience for this stuff. Winter is only three weeks away with snow on the hills already and this plant isn't even flowering properly yet!!!! For really extreme sativa though I've never had plants like the Realseed Red Hair Thai. I'm not sure why they call it red hair Thai because none of my plants have ever had any red hairs... so far. This stuff is just off the charts crazy sativa. Stretchiest strain, probably the tallest ever if I hadn't kept topping it, latest flowering ever, longest flowering ever..... Anyway this is what a red hair Thai female bud looks like after the plant has been growing seven months and flowering for a month and the days are already only 11 hours daylight with frosts, winter round the corner...... everything else except seed plants harvested.... Now that's what I call a stubborn Thai. scrubdog 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxo 12,616 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 Hallo Scrubdog,welcome aboard looking verrry nice down there,you lucky ones,...facing Haresttime,while we´re planting the little ones out.... .....the LaoPure x Thai82 sounds&looks great!!! i´m curious Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 Okay.... This is a RoboThai. Two weeks after this photo was taken the whole plant got so big it fell over and uprooted itself. It is still alive but I had to prune it back and tie it up. All the seed crop sativas are so big they are tied up every which way. Everytime I visit there are snapped branches and plants fallen over. They're all top heavy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 Now for some extreme sativa porn.... old school crop Realseed Red Hair Thai The big daddy male that is pollinating my girls.... A close-up.... It's all one plant and I've chopped over half the flowering tops off already.... crazy mutant beast of a plant... he he So that's the big daddy Thai that will be the father of many of my strains.... hopefully... if I actually manage to ripen any seed before the plants are killed by winter. scrubdog 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 and onwards we go.... welcome to my world.... The Seed Crop On the left is Red Hair Thai backup male and a female and on the right in foreground is Neville Haze. Behind that is laoxThai82. The broken plants in centre is all that's left of 30 Ace Malawi plants. Two plants with a single bottom branch each left. Stem rot absolutely hammered the malawi. I was expecting a monsoon aware strain but it absolutely hates water and thrives in hot dry conditions. Shame because it is savagely potent. I did manage to mature a single scrawny four foot high Ace Malawi but forgot to photograph it. Plant turned purple and had a hit like a sledgehammer. If only I'd seeded it. Anyway... In the next photo you can see the giant Red Hair Thai male towering over the crop.... Backup Red Hair Thai male with some red thai females.... much more delicate and slender looking plants to some of the others but for those who don't remember.... that's what Haze used to look like.... My backup Red Hair Thai male.... now how's that for pure sativa expression? This is exactly what Original Haze used to look like from the seedbanks in the eighties before they messed with it.... scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 Retro... Classic Thai Plant. This is Red hair Thai female showing classic Thai plant structure. You can see where it was topped. Two weeks after this photo was taken the plant got top heavy (it's about twelve feet high) and toppled over. At the moment it's pruned back and fighting for survival. On the left is my LaoxThai82 and on right is a Red Hair Thai female Closeup of the Red Thai bud... this is the most advanced Red Hair Thai bud of all of them. Most are still preflowering... scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 10, 2013 for a change of pace.... Another delightful Roboskunk strain. I actually ended up losing this bud (the whole plant actually) to mould but it sure looked good... The same plant two weeks later all covered in mold.... it's okay though. It was an experimental planting and it failed. That's what experiments are all about. I won't use that location again. I know exactly why it happened now and I learnt a lot from the disaster. Completely my own fault and I will explain what I learnt when I have time. Just very poor choice of location through not being familiar with the terrain and climate. Basically I planted in a hollow expecting a windless sun trap. Instead it was a frost trap (ground stayed cold too long) and lack of air movement meant party time for mould. Live and learn. This happened in just two windless humid nights after a day of rain... A portion of the plantation totally wiped out by mould. Look closely and you will see every single bud and growing tip on every plant is actually rotten... like slimey mouldey rotten... right that's enough for now.... plenty more to come.... scrubdog 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doush 1 Report post Posted May 11, 2013 Its good to see someone keeping those 80's strains alive and trying to breed them outdoors is very rare these days... goodluck. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxo 12,616 Report post Posted May 11, 2013 ....i have to second this, doush ...(btw,welcome to Opengrow ) Heya Scrubdog,we got the Mould´n´Rot -Problems too up here,so don´t be mad about much...it´s just one of the obstacles on the way into our jars Keep it up,Bro Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 28, 2013 Well it's rained non-stop for two weeks and this morning I woke up to a foot of snow at my back door and a snow blizzard outside..... so I suspect that I no longer have any plants left and unfortunately I totally stuffed up this season and didn't grow a single seed... which is what I really wanted. Once again the big success was Robogro's strains. This is the third time I've done a planting and only actually harvested Robogro's strains.... although this season I lost most of his to mould as well. He really does grow some decent strains and does some wicked crosses. Even though it was a complete disaster I really like the RoboThai. Huge pure sativa that had a yummy smell and taste. Unfortunately I didn't seed any of his skunk lines because I pulled out all the males too soon and it wasn't till I cured a few buds for a month or so that I realised some of the purple lines had a decent kick to them. I've got a few seeds left so I'll run them next year and try to get some seed this time. I've got heaps of photos and I may post some more but I'm a bit sad at the moment so I'll just leave this thread until I decide if I want to add anything to it. Basically I grew a LOT of plants and ended up with mostly hay and mould but I learnt a lot this season and it takes awhile to dial in a new location and dial in new strains. All credit to Robogro for his assistance in time of need.... scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 29, 2013 Well to my surprise I still have plants.... Growing tropical sativas in the snow.... scrubdog The weight of snow snapped my biggest female Mango Thai plant... scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scrubdog 9 Report post Posted May 29, 2013 ..... .... so I fixed it with a bit of bamboo and string (Robogro would be proud of me) Check out the snow.... more photos later... I'm just happy that I still have something growing. Talk about an epic season though. Lost two whole plantations to mould, .... then there was snow storms, biggest plants snapped in half, had a run in with a wild boar.... sheesh what an adventure this year.... Getting too old for this.... scrubdog Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lurk Daddy 78 Report post Posted May 29, 2013 This is an awesome fuckin thread Scrubdog regardless of the setbacks! I've had years where all my goods were taken by deer, mould, thieves, or caterpillars(relentless little bastards!). Stoked to see someone growing the old sativas. Wherever you are looks awesome as well. Keep up the hard work and keep updating! This is alot more exciting than most threads. Take care. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
